Hdtv Set-top-boxes I Use.

[Thomas Yingling]

I Have A Few To Pick From To Do My Digital Tv Dx On.
My Main One Is A Sony Sat-hd-200 That I Use For Direct Tv Sat.
I Also Have For Direct Tv Use A Sony Sat-hd-300.
Other Brands Are Radio Shack Accurian, The Rca Atsc11, A Motorola Hdt-101, Then The Computer Pci Cards My Oldest Hdtv Receiver Win-tv-d And The Newest Ati Hdtv Wonder.

Right Now The Motorola Is Giving Me Problems In Working, And I Finnally Got The Ati Computer Card To Work With Windows Xp Pro. It Won't Work With Windows Xp Media Edition 2005 At All.

What Do You Use? 73's Tom

[Mike-CT]

Currently the Accurian box and the WinTV-D card. I've also had the Sylvania ATSC/NTSC box and the Old Zenith (250 or 240 0r something like that). The Sylvania was pretty good with analog plus digital, but I have a good vintage Zenith for analog so the Radio Shack box is all I need. Of course, what I really need is some good DX conditions and some empty channels.

[Michael-NJ]

Here when I hookup my antennas for HDTV DXing it’s almost exclusively the Accurian. However, I also have a Win TVD card which I've had for years.

[chris]

Although I'd like to have a WinTV-D card, the only one I use for DXing is the Accurian box. I wonder how many people in the club actually have that.

I might be the only one though, who actually has it hooked up to a widescreen HDTV.

I've had one problem with it lately though...everytime I turn it off, it forgets some of the channels that I've added. I'm not sure what's the problem there.

:cool:

Chris

[Guy in WNY]

I also have the in Win TV-D card and the Accurian box from Radio Shack. I think a number of us - club members - went and got them when RS sold them all out. My compter is broken in the shack, so I'll be looking for a PIII 450Mhz w/lot of ram this summer at yard sales. Maybe I'll just go with a new Dell - I can just get it on my Dell card and pay it off before 90 days.
The computer also has the ATI All-In-Wonder video card which has analog TV on it.
That'sit from Lockport, NY.
Guy

[antennanut]

Well, as my first post, I'd like to ask if the club members still like the Accurian box. My Dish Network set top box includes the OTA tuner card, but it isn't super sensitive. The built in tuner in my JVC HDTV is pretty sensitive but it won't allow adding or viewing channels that aren't locked into memory by scanning (which I personally cannot understand why any DTV tuner would still have the lack of direct entry this late in the DTV game). Is there another box anyone has found that he likes better than the Accurian?

Thanks for any info!

Tommy

[Danny]

I have three STBs, and they all have good points and bad points. And none of them are produced any longer.

Some people think the latest Samsung is good.

Danny
Shreveport, LA

[antennanut]

Thanks Danny. I've had trouble locating a model number for a Samsung set top on their own website, but I see a model DTBH260F on Amazon - do you know if this is the latest?

[Mike-CT]

I don't think there's a best box available, what there is, is the best of the worst, if you ask me. You don't want remapping but you get it with all the boxes. The RCA ATSC-11 will show the call letters when it sees the channel but it remaps. It has a green button that shows you when you have a station too weak to decode. That's about the best you get. I had one but got rid of it for other reasons. It wouldn't see my DTV Fox affiliate on ch31. It showed a huge signal but never decoded. I didn't feel like calling up WTIC ch61 and telling them to upgrade their software to make my box see it.

Another problem I had was with DTV ch39 about 50 miles south. It sits right next to my local analog ch40. The Accurian could see it fine. The RCA didn't know it existed...no signal at all.

But the Accurian has its own problems. The remote can be sluggish and will bog down badly sometimes. This is what I hate most about it. If you program in all your DX available channels the remote will almost refuse to work. The lag is so bad you'll want to give up trying. And this is not only with the remote but also with the up/down buttons on the front of the box.

Just before seeing your post here, I was looking at eBay and bought myself a Samsung SIRT151 for $40. Prices are really dropping on a lot of those boxes. So, I'll try the Samsung. If I like it even a tad better, the Accurian will go on eBay. Stay tuned.

DTV DXing is much more frustrating than analog DXing.

Also I see you use the HD 9095. I had one and it's now in my basement. I'm using a CM 8-Bay now. My subjective opinion is that it has more gain and I can watch my three VHF DTVs on 10,11 and 12 where I could not with the Winegard.

I have the AP4700 preamp. IMO, the CM7775 (I think that's the UHF only version) works better...more gain. I used the CM until it died and had the AP4700 sitting there, so that took its place.

[Danny]

I don't think there's a best box available, what there is, is the best of the worst, if you ask me.

You are right about that. However, Greg Barker sure has done well using ATSC11 boxes. I think his big antenna array really helps.


Just before seeing your post here, I was looking at eBay and bought myself a Samsung SIRT151 for $40.

Is that the latest model?


DTV DXing is much more frustrating than analog DXing.

That is an understatement.

Danny
Shreveport, LA

[antennanut]

I suppose what I'm hearing you both say is not only is DTV DXing frustrating, but so are the DTV boxes. I truthfully have not done any real DTV DXing so I can't speak to that (I don't think watching Huntsville, Alabama DTV about 75 miles away qualifies as DX). But just from what I have seen from owning two Dish network (different model) boxes with the OTA tuner card, and my TV's built in DTV tuner - well "frustrating" sums it up. Why do we even have to "add" channels to a menu - why can't we simply use a remote's up/down buttons to tune without the requirement of adding??? I know all of the various subchannels some stations offer make this an impossible dream - but I still dream it! Nonetheless, that's one thing I have never liked with DTV tuners, and probably one reason I have not really DXed DTV - what channels would I add when DX is rolling??

I bought the HD 9095 and the Winegard 8 Bay at the same time, I think about 6 or 7 years ago. I tested the two and decided the 9095 was a little better, so I have stuck with it (while still keeping the 8 Bay in reserve, just in case I need it). I wanted the CM 8 Bay, but could not find a website that would ship it UPS at the time - but I have always thought in the back of my mind the CM be a better 8 Bay. I know there are several websites that will ship the CM now - any thoughts on whether or not it might outperform the Winegard 8 Bay?

Thanks guys for the feedback. I don't know why it took me so long to find this website!

[Mike-CT]

Thanks guys for the feedback. I don't know why it took me so long to find this website!

Well, we've only had this site for a little over 2 years :-)

[KC5KBV]

My shack DTV box is a RS Accurian and a US Digital (Hisense) DB 2010 as a backup. Its fed into a WinTV Go NTSC card. A small stack of a CM 4228 and a small 4 element VHF log-periodic receive the signals w/a rotor.

This morning, I pulled in several Memphis locals, but its the Shreveport stations that are annoying pests these days

(I do have a Dish Vip211 and a Panasonic DMR 37 DVD-R/VHS combo for the living room--the Vip211 has Shreveport OTA as well as Little Rock OTA in memory but its not my dx rig).

Fritze,
Star City, AR

[antennanut]

Well, we've only had this site for a little over 2 years :-)

And I just mailed my check yesterday for VUD. Like I said, where have I been?

Looks like the Accurian is still a good choice. Maybe then I'll grab some of those Shreveport pests!

[Danny]

In spite of my criticism of DTV DXing, I think every serious TV DXer should give DTV DX a good try. You might really like it.

The CM 8-bay supposedly is more directional and has more gain than the Winegard.

I hope you do log my local DTVs. Huntsville UHFs were pretty common here until a few years ago. I did manage to log WHNT-DT last fall.

Welcome to WTFDA.

Danny
Shreveport, LA

[antennanut]

Thanks for the welcome, Danny. I am sooo tempted to grab a CM 8 bay.

Mike - please keep us posted on the Samsung's performance.

Even though I haven't done any DTV DXing, I am looking forward to giving it a shot. And thanks to this forum, I am looking forward to dusting off my trusty Zenith 1976 B & W TV for some analog DXing. I have gotten used to using my HDTV for analog signals just for simplicity, and I bet the Zenith will stomp it!

[JeffK-PA]

Thanks for the welcome, Danny. I am sooo tempted to grab a CM 8 bay.

Mike - please keep us posted on the Samsung's performance.

I bought their DTB-H260F because of how well my Samsung TV does at processing signals. Not only that, but I had a 12% off coupon from Best Buy and bought $150 worth of gift cards at a supermarket that earned me 30¢ off/gallon of gas at their stations :D.

I use it on my bedroom set and it only gets one less station than my main set, since that station only runs at 362kw. The only thing I don't like is that there are no on-screen graphics via the coax output, which isn't bad for the purpose it serves and it's easy to know what station you're watching. The sensitivity is just what I expected.

[antennanut]

In the past week, I have managed to acquire the Accurian box and also a Samsung DTB-H260F. The Samsung generally seems to be a little more sensitive than the Accurian, but the Accurian gets high marks for the ability to "update" to add new channels while keeping previously stored channels. The Accurian also has a MUCH better signal strength indicator which is more easily accessible via a dedicated button on the remote.

Last night (Saturday) I was able to snag 5 Memphis DTV stations, which truly surprised me because the analog signals were not much stronger than normal (meaning I barely could make out any video on analog). Memphis is about 180 miles away, so this is my first true DTV DX.

However - the built-in tuner in my HDTV is still more sensitive than either box. But it is also less flexible than either box.

I'm disappointed OTA set top boxes are getting harder to find. They need to continue to manufacture them and keep them updated with the latest advances rather than take them off the market. I know that is from a DX point of view, which unfortunately does not carry over into the general populace.

[Mike-CT]

Well I did buy a Samsung SIRT-151 on eBay for $45. This is an older box...someone told me it was made around 2002. However, it can still stand up to the newer Accurian box.

I like the remote better on the Samsung. The Accurian remote bogs down and sometimes gets so sluggish it refuses to work.

I don't like the meter. The Accurian's gives more information and it's easy to activate the meter with one press of the button.

For some reason I think the Samsung gives a better looking picture.

The Accurian is a bit more sensitive.

The Accurian won't automatically put stations into memory. You have to manually add the channel. The Samsung throws them into memory as soon as it detects the signals. With both sets you can manually add stations or auto-scan.

What the Samsung has is a green LED next to the power button. It's marked DTV and lights up when a DTV station is located. What's neat is that it also lights when the DTV station is too weak to decode. I was able to make the channels on a weak station remap by pressing the info button even though no video was showing.

Also one weak station decoded for a split second and remapped the call letters and channel numbers and stored them into memory. That's fast!

I'm going to keep the Samsung box and use it next summer to try to capture some ch2 digital E skip. I can leave the box on all night and check in the morning to see what if anything remapped overnight.

Maybe you noticed that the Accurian meter shows signals of analog stations. At least mine does. I get a signal halfway up the meter from my analogs on 38, 43, 65, etc. These don't have digital counterparts. This is really annoying to me and the Samsung doesn't do it. If the Samsung shows a signal, you know it's digital.

Hey, just $40 for a set top box that originally cost over $300. Who would have thought it would come down to this.

[antennanut]

Heck, I paid more for the Accurian than $40!

Your Samsung box sounds very different than mine. I don't have the green LED next to the power button. I also have not seen it automatically memorize stations - I have only seen it add stations by auto-scanning. Therefore, I also haven't notice it remap just by leaving it on. Maybe it is my inexperience with using a separate OTA box. As further evidence of my inexperience, my Accurian doesn't appear to do anything with analog stations without digital counterparts, nor have I been able to add a station with either box manually. Somewhere I'm missing something?

Still thinking about trying a CM 8 Bay in place of my HD 9095.

[Mike-CT]

Take a look at your Accurian remote control. You have six buttons beneath the select button/arrows. One is help, one is freeze (useful), CH-ADD and CH-DEL, sleep and METER. To manually add a channel, press the numbers on the keypad and when the video appears, press ch-add. The channel adds to memory and remaps with the call letters. You can do this using the menus but it's a pain in the....

[Danny]

Maybe you noticed that the Accurian meter shows signals of analog stations. At least mine does. I get a signal halfway up the meter from my analogs on 38, 43, 65, etc. These don't have digital counterparts. This is really annoying to me and the Samsung doesn't do it. If the Samsung shows a signal, you know it's digital.

I agree, that is an annoying feature of the Accurian.

Sounds like you got a good deal on the Samsung.

I'm looking forward to reading your reports of DTV via Es.

Danny

[antennanut]

Take a look at your Accurian remote control. You have six buttons beneath the select button/arrows. One is help, one is freeze (useful), CH-ADD and CH-DEL, sleep and METER. To manually add a channel, press the numbers on the keypad and when the video appears, press ch-add. The channel adds to memory and remaps with the call letters. You can do this using the menus but it's a pain in the....

Maybe part of my problem is I enter a channel number, but it is a channel that is too weak to display/decode. I assume that it will not be added to the memory if it doesn't decode? Nonetheless, I didn't know about this feature, so that is definitely good info to know.

If I may ask something that may be so obvious it should be smacking me in the face. When trying to DX DTV on channels other than those in memory - do you just start with channel 14 and start entering every channel to see if something decodes? I hate to re-scan every time, especially on the Samsung where I now have the Memphis DTV stations in memory just in case one happens to have a strong enough signal to decode for a moment - which happened tonight.

[Mike-CT]

Maybe part of my problem is I enter a channel number, but it is a channel that is too weak to display/decode. I assume that it will not be added to the memory if it doesn't decode? Nonetheless, I didn't know about this feature, so that is definitely good info to know.

If I may ask something that may be so obvious it should be smacking me in the face. When trying to DX DTV on channels other than those in memory - do you just start with channel 14 and start entering every channel to see if something decodes? I hate to re-scan every time, especially on the Samsung where I now have the Memphis DTV stations in memory just in case one happens to have a strong enough signal to decode for a moment - which happened tonight.

If you want to add ch 21 (which is an empty channel), press 2 and 1. Then press CH-add. You will add an empty channel. If you add all of your empty channels in this manner, if your Accurian works like mine, you'll slow down the up/down button to such an extent that it will be difficult to move up and down the channels with your remote. That's why I don't do it that way anymore. Sounds great in theory but bogs down in reality.

With all my DTVs in memory, I will go hunting for other signals by pressing the channel numbers on the remote. I only have 14,15,16,17,21,23,26,27 29,32,34,42,44,45,47,48, 49 and 52, 53,54,56 to check.

I don't rescan unless I put too much junk in memory. The less you put in memory, the less remapping you have in memory. And all the remapping may confuse the heck out of you and keep you from seeing something you otherwise would.

Fun, ain't it?

[Danny]

If you want to add ch 21 (which is an empty channel), press 2 and 1. Then press CH-add. You will add an empty channel.


Mike, you make some good points. However, I don't add empty channels to the Accurian because it prevents the STB from obtaining and displaying PSIP data, and it prevents the STB from adding subchannels. That is the major problem with Es on the Accurian.

There are some good reasons behind my desire to obtain PSIP IDs (in addition to vanity). With short-lived Es receptions and weak tropo, PSIP might be all that you can receive. Even if video developes, you might not ever receive an on-air ID, especially with Es.

As for subchannels, sometimes you can find on-air ID material on a subchannel (a local weather channel for example) without waiting around while there are other DX signals that need to be IDed.

To me, the best DTV IDs are those that show the STB's PSIP data banner and a station's on-air ID together.

I like to see and record PSIP IDs, and the Accurian's PSIP data banner displays larger calls than most other STBs.

Danny
Shreveport, LA

[Danny]

There are some good reasons behind my desire to obtain PSIP IDs (in addition to vanity). With short-lived Es receptions and weak tropo, PSIP might be all that you can receive.

Well, well. Silly me. Of course, the Accurian will not receive PSIP data without the presence of video...except on an automatic scan. I have logged several PSIP-only signals on automatic scans.

[antennanut]

Thanks Danny and Mike for the responses. It's really going to be a challenge to DX DTV unless a manufacturer puts a box on the market with some features that will help us. And given the fact that new boxes don't seem to be a priority, well...:banghead:

[Danny]

Thanks Danny and Mike for the responses. It's really going to be a challenge to DX DTV unless a manufacturer puts a box on the market with some features that will help us. And given the fact that new boxes don't seem to be a priority, well...:banghead:

Don't let that stop you. DTV DXing is possible.

[antennanut]

One thing I dislike is the mostly "all or nothing" aspect of DTV. I always check analog reception before trying digital, and I usually must have an almost snow free picture on analog to have a chance at the digital signal. The exception has been Huntsville AL at 75 miles away - I often can decode a couple of Huntsville DTV stations even when analog is only marginally better than usual. Other locations seem to require a pretty darned strong analog signal before digital pops to life.

[antennanut]

Oh, by the way Mike, nice articles on the Accurian/Samsung DTV boxes and Sangean AM/FM tuner!

[Mark]

Looks like an appropriate thread to wake up for the question I have.

I’ve been researching current model HDTV sets trying to find one that doesn’t delete stored DTV channels if they are not received when doing a re-scan.

I've yet to find one and wondering if anyone here can point me to one to try out.

I’m surprised all sets don’t have this feature, assuming there are quite a few average viewers are still using antenna rotors and need to scan-in from several directions.

On those days when conditions are active it’s nice to just hit scan to see what’s tickling the antenna. The stand-alone tuner I have has an “update” scan that does not delete anything, but it will overwrite where a RF/Virtual channel match happens, and there are a couple of those near here.

[Danny]

Mark, I don't have any ideas. My DTV DXing has all been on STBs.

Weren't you a WTFDA member a few years back? It seems that I recall having been in contact with you via e-mail at one time.

What have you received on those big, high antennas?

[Mark]

Yes I was a member back in the 70’s and 80’s. Attended conventions in OKC, New Orleans, and a mountain somewhere in north GA (loved that spot!). Still have some photos from those gatherings. I joined the DX listserv a few years back and think I communicated with you then.

I recently went to work for LPB as a “roving transmitter site engineer” and that was the main impetus to get the spider webs off that Channel Master antenna I bought back in ‘79. I haven’t been real diligent at DXing these days although hot conditions still excite me, as does my girlfriend, but in a different way ;-) So far the best DTV catches I’ve had are Austin, Nashville, and Tallahassee, no record breakers here.

FM used to be my favorite medium for DX & listening, but with the clutter of the band with all the low-powered mosquitoes and roaches, and cookie-cutter formats, I rarely listen. XM Radio makes days on the road enjoyable.

I get over to Shreveport just about every week, like to see your rig sometime, or if you want to drive up Hwy 1 and see the site if you haven’t already. I assume that’s your antennas on the …DX Exposition website.

[Danny]

I get over to Shreveport just about every week, like to see your rig sometime, or if you want to drive up Hwy 1 and see the site if you haven’t already. I assume that’s your antennas on the …DX Exposition website.


Thanks for your interest in my DX setup and your kind offer to show me the KLTS site. Maybe in the months to come I wil be able to catch up with you some week. My wife has had serious health problems since 2001, so she doesn't feel like having company at the house very often these days. (Besides that, all you would see is a bunch old TVs, VCRs, STBs, etc.)

Please keep WTFDA members informed about your DXing activities.